English gym

alec ha scritto:thnx

You're welcome.

Fux89 ha scritto:I started reading the Harry Potter series in English.

I have just added you on anobii.

Rasputin ha scritto:I don't like Harry Pothead

Shame on you.

alec ha scritto:I found them quite boring and, but that was as expected, rather childish.

Well, the first two (maybe three) books are kind of "childish" (but they're still good ), but the others are not.

Cosworth117 ha scritto:I have just added you on anobii.

And I've just added you.

Rasputin ha scritto:

Steerpike ha scritto:"God dog" sounds better: it's palindrome.
God anchorman at Mediaset

But no English native speaker would understand it...

And if I said "God sodium ion from a bottle of Lete, and now in the extracellular matrix which can't enter in the Na⁺/K⁺ pump because it is too small, and this awakes in him old freudian frustrations"?

Rasputin ha scritto:
try these, "Madam, I'm Adam"

"A man, a plan, a canal: Panama"

Ok.

Steerpike ha scritto:And if I said "God sodium ion from a bottle of Lete, and now in the extracellular matrix which can't enter in the Na⁺/K⁺ pump because it is too small, and this awakes in him old freudian frustrations"?

They'd think you're crazy.

I have to do the Trinity Exam (level 7). In the first five minutes, I have to talk about a topic on my choice. In your opinion, can I talk about number theory?

Steerpike ha scritto:I have to do the Trinity Exam (level 7). In the first five minutes, I have to talk about a topic on my choice. In your opinion, can I talk about number theory?

"A topic of my choice"

I don't know Steerpike, I never heard you speaking English. It is a very narrowly specialized field, I guess if you have a good drive on the terminology it might overshadow the inevitable little grammar mistakes you make due to the early stage of your learning process.

The only suggestion comin'up my mind right now is, try to find some video on the tube or elsewhere, listen then try to repeat.

I'd say that people testing you won't give a crap about the discussion topic, as long as your English is up to their standards. This is my personal and professional opinion (I've trained many ESL students for TOEIC and TOEFL tests). I can only suggest you decide for a topic you feel comfortable with and prepare it before hand.

@Diva: I posted that comment without knowing (not my fault) and without asking (my fault) what a "Trinity exam" is...

Rasputin ha scritto:@Diva: I posted that comment without knowing (not my fault) and without asking (my fault) what a "Trinity exam" is...

... It doesn't have anything to do with the Matrix...

@ Steerpike: you don't DO a test, you TAKE a test...

Damn connectives.
I think I have a good vocabulary about number theory: I translated many en.wikipedia pages in Italian in this field. Can you train me, given that Cosworth117 isn't very active? Actually, I don't get very well in a language where I must express my thougts without a lot of third subordinates.

Steerpike ha scritto:Damn connectives.
I think I have a good vocabulary about number theory: I translated many en.wikipedia pages in Italian in this field. Can you train me, given that Cosworth117 isn't very active? Actually, I don't get very well in a language where I must express my thougts without a lot of third subordinates.

As far as I'm concerned, I'd gladly help you but bear in mind that:

a) I'm not a teacher, I'm only an interpreter

b) Diva is probably right about "people testing you won't give a crap about the discussion topic, as long as your English is up to their standards"...she might be bloody well right

c) I believe Diva (We know each other a bit, also outside of the forum) has a bit more experience in teaching.

Given this, just go ahead and ask the questions you wish

Thank you very much. How can I take time, if I have to think to a sentence? Are there any intercalary words or phrases?

Steerpike ha scritto:Thank you very much. How can I take time, if I have to think toof a sentence? Are there any intercalary words or phrases?

It depends on whom you're talking to

Think of?
Is there a general rule for connectives?

Rasputin ha scritto:

Steerpike ha scritto:Thank you very much. How can I take time, if I have to think toof a sentence? Are there any intercalary words or phrases?

It depends on whom you're talking to

@Steerpike: do you usually translate the sentence from Italian into English before you say it? I don't know much about your level, because the fact you are very good in written English doesn't mean you can speak fluently. The immediacy of the spoken language is often a problem, and the fact you say you might need time to think makes me suppose that you have a problem with your fluency...
Anyway, you have a big advantage here: you can prepare your speech before hand. If I were you, I'd pick a different topic, you don't need to impress anyone, you just need to show the board that you have a good knowledge of the language.

Steerpike ha scritto:Think of?
Is there a general rule for connectives?

What do you mean? Connectives are just words you need to use in order to link two sentences... just like you do in Italian...

Take a look at this: http://www.english-on-the-web.de/vconnect.htm

Yes, I usually don't think directly in English. However, every topis has got his own vocabulary: I must think of one which I know well.

What do you mean? Connectives are just words you need to use in order to link two sentences... just like you do in Italian...

Sorry, I mean prepositions between verbs and nouns.

"Verbs + prepositions" is one of the most wide and complicated topic of the English grammar...

I know.

Steerpike ha scritto:I know.

ok if you wanna practice a bit, you can try to build some short sentences containing

- of

- on

- off

- at

- to

Either Diva or I will check then them out and tell you what might be right, wrong, and (I don't promise this) why

Steerpike ha scritto:Yes, I usually don't think directly in English. However, every topis has got his own vocabulary: I must think of one which I know well.

well I'm not an expert but I think that the test you'll be taking is going to be something more than "showing off" your knowledge of a bunch of specific technical lemmas.
If I were an examiner I'd value more you being able to answer with ease to those random questions which might arise during a conversation rather than you knowing specific terms.

Also, Keep in mind that easily you examiner won't be very into the subject you have chosen so you'll have to be able to explain it using in a simple way using common words, not technical ones.


@ Rasp, Diva: please feel free to correct any mistakes I may have made, my written english is quite rusty 'cos I never practice it; it has been ages since I wrote such a long piece of text in English

alec ha scritto:
well I'm not an expert but I think that the test you'll be taking is going to be something more than "showing off" your knowledge of a bunch of specific technical lemmas.
If I were an examiner I'd value more you being able your ability to answer with ease to those random questions which might arise during a conversation rather than you knowing your knowledge of specific terms.

Also, Keep in mind that (easily)? you examiner won't be very much into the subject you have chosen so you'll have to be able to explain it using common words in a simple way using common words, not instead of technical ones.


@ Rasp, Diva: please feel free to correct any mistakes I may have made, my written english is quite rusty 'cos I never practice it; it has been ages since I wrote such a long piece of text in English

I have not seen a lot to correct, but I tried to pick on the more outstanding, check it out

thanks!!

writing "I'd value more you being able" is a mistake or just bad form?

alec ha scritto:thanks!!

writing "I'd value more you being able" is a mistake or just bad form?

Talkative. Contracting "I would" into "I'd" is also correct in the written form (as far as I know).

Contracting, for instance, "want to" into "wanna" might put one at some more risk

I was wondering if it would be a good idea to look for work as a private english Tutor, back in Italy.
Do you think I've got any chances or worse, some kind of legal barrier?

PaperJack ha scritto:I was wondering if would be a good idea to look for work as a private english Tutor, back in Italy.
Do you think I've got any chances or worse, some kind of legal barrier?

Right now I'd work anywhere but in itagly, as anything, not even as a road sweeper

But that's where I'll be for the next 3 years

PaperJack ha scritto:But that's where I'll be for the next 3 years

My two cents: learn to bake pizzas. It'll be fun for 2 years and the pay is not bad.

Actually, I'm not bad at baking pizza here at home...

Rasputin ha scritto:

Steerpike ha scritto:I know.

ok if you wanna practice a bit, you can try to build some short sentences containing

- of

- on

- off

- at

- to

Either Diva or I will check then them out and tell you what might be right, wrong, and (I don't promise this) why

cadavre exquisi-mode:
The relation in which there are your bancomat numbers is on the table of the secret building at Cassano Magnago, and if you speak with Mr. Trout he won't sell it to the Catholic church, which would be very interested in these data because there are few days off the Cardinal's birthday.

Steerpike ha scritto:
cadavre exquisi-mode:
The relation REPORT in which there are your bancomat numbers ARE (I would use "that contains your bancomat numbers"...) is on the (THE? are you talking about a table that both of you already know?) table of IN the secret building at IN Cassano Magnago, and if you speak with Mr. Trout he won't sell it to the Catholic church, which would be very interested in these data because there are few days off the Cardinal's birthday (What's this supposed to mean?).

Alright... a couple of suggestions:

Unless both you and the person you are talking to know exactly what object you are referring to, never use THE. In the case only you know what you are talking about, always use A.

Probably British or American people won't know what a Bancomat is... use the word ATM.

Try not to use very long sentences, English is radically different from Italian... you need to keep it simple, don't use too many dependent clauses.

Diva, I'm sorry but I don't find your explanation of the difference between THE and A clear enought for others to understand it.

THE is determinative. It means "il / la" in italian, as in:
"Il ponte è lungo" - "The bridge is long".
It's used to refer to a specific object.

On the other hand, A is indeterminative. That means it can be used for generalizations and not being specific. It can be compared to the italian "uno/una". For example...
"Prendi una matita" becomes "Take a pencil".

PaperJack ha scritto:Diva, I'm sorry but I don't find your explanation of the difference between THE and A clear enought for others to understand it.

THE is determinative. It means "il / la" in italian, as in:
"Il ponte è lungo" - "The bridge is long".
It's used to refer to a specific object.

On the other hand, A is indeterminative. That means it can be usded for generalizations and not being specific. It can be compared to the italian "uno/una". For example...
"Prendi una matita" becomes "Take a pencil".

That's right. My explanation addressed the specific issue in Steerpike's text: unless both of the people know exactly about the object of the conversation (the table, the building... etc), it is not appropriate to use the definite article THE, therefore -in this specific case- he must use the indefinite article A.

Good job Diva - one thing only, never heard about "Cash dispensers"?

Then:

Unless both you and the person you are talking to know exactly what object you are referring to, never use THE. In the case only you know what you are talking about, always use A.

I'd say, "In case", but also "In the event".

That's right. My explanation addressed the specific issue in Steerpike's text: unless both of the people know exactly about the object of the conversation (the table, the building... etc), it is not appropriate to use the definite article THE, therefore -in this specific case- he must use the indefinite article A.

Similarly, I'd simply say "both people".

I suggest not to use informal speech contractions, it does not help those who need to improve their English.

Informal speech contractions are used by writers in their novels, you can hear them when you go to the cinema.

Rasputin ha scritto:Good job Diva - one thing only, never heard about "Cash dispensers"?

Nope... maybe they were just talking about a guy they wanted to rip off!

Well, a "Bancomat" is actually called cash dispenser...

Rasputin ha scritto:Well, a "Bancomat" is actually called cash dispenser...

It makes sense, but I have never heard it. I've always called it ATM (automated teller machine, not ass to mouth ) or Cash-point.

Thank you for the correction. Let us try again:
In San Marino Republic there are many military bases. San marino has got also lots of nuclear weapons; recently it declared war to the United States of America. San Marino easily won the war, and now the US president is the San Marino's chief of army. This was imposed in the peace treaty. As well, United States yielded to Swaziland, an ally of San Marino in the war, all its bases on the dark side of the moon. An undisclosed clause of the treaty forces the former president Santorum to clean the floor of San Marino's government palace twice per week.

God contestant of Big Bother 12.

Diva ha scritto:"Verbs + prepositions" is one of the most wide and complicated topic of the English grammar...

Yep! And I hate it. I think I go wrong almost always, damn ,

Diva ha scritto:

Rasputin ha scritto:Well, a "Bancomat" is actually called cash dispenser...

It makes sense, but I have never heard it. I've always called it ATM (automated teller machine, not ass to mouth ) or Cash-point.

Me too. I know ATM, cash point or cash machine, never heard about cash dispenser, although it is quite self explanatory.

my point: it is plain unjust and eventually useless to carefully analyze "real" english.
phrasal verbs, idioms etc are just NOT what we need. English people MUST understand that in order to create and utilize an universal language, yes, it is true, English was chosen, but some sort of "international" English, the same we use for scientific papers: simplified and "technical". they too should work on that!!
I hate this sense of "you should know what put across/away/back/down/off/on/out/whatthefuck/ means..."
NOOOOO
YOU should become accustomed to use with foreign people less "english" but far more "international" terms like communicate, discard, consume, imprison, insult...

we have to work hard on that... you too fucking bastards!!!

Not to put you off or to argue you down, but I'd think through twice before trowing away all the phrasal verbs and pass off the idea that we could be better off using other more "international" terms.
I don't think your solution would pan out easily for everyone; most of the terms you summed up under the word "international" come from latin; to all those English speakers' whose native languages are not Romance picking up latin derived terms wouldn't be any easier.
Moreover, once you get into them, phrasal verbs can be just plain fun and spice up your speech.

I was not referring especially on phrasal verbs (I still disagree with you) but just arguing about a too strict English phrase formation and shape, to say nothing about pronounce... When I am attending some international meeting, I perfectly understand Swedish or Dutch or German people who generally use a much more plain and - again - "international" language, very often avoiding the use of phrasal verbs and peculiar constructions; it is not unusual to have an American or English or - even worse - Australian being just a hell to be understood, mostly in my case because of pronounce - I know phrasal verbs decently well - but also for a too "natural" phrase construction.
phrasal verbs can spice up your speech but they just do not enhance AT ALL mutual understanding among not-english people.
That is my experience (30y).

well, I was just pulling your leg

Not to put you off or to argue you down, but I'd think through twice before trowing away all the phrasal verbs and pass off the idea that we could be better off using other more "international" terms.
I don't think your solution would pan out easily for everyone; most of the terms you summed up under the word "international" come from latin; to all those English speakers' whose native languages are not Romance picking up latin derived terms wouldn't be any easier.
Moreover, once you get into them, phrasal verbs can be just plain fun and spice up your speech.

Australians' pronounciation is freakin' awful.

And, by the way, I fully agree with Alberto.

happiness is a worn gum
-josh pennon-

However, I care a lot speaking correctly in Italian, so I'd like to can speak well also in English.

Steerpike ha scritto:However, I care a lot speaking correctly in Italian, so I'd like to can speak well also in English.

The first part of the phrase is mostly correct, while the second part is a mess.
The correct form would be...
"However, I care a lot about speaking correctly in Italian, so I'd also like to be able to speak well in English."

Thank you for the correction. Maybe I could try to write in an English forum, to learn the correct forms.